I'm losing my team and I don't know what to do.

[ohcomeon]

I'm a GMTL who was promoted from GM Team member. The long story short is that my GM team doesn't like that my SD and GM ETL have started to become more strict about enforcing freight push goals. Me and other leaders have been keeping an extra close eye on the team in terms how long it takes for them to do their one-for-one's, when they start push, and how long they spend on a given vehicle.

To give a more thorough picture, I'll explain what's been going on the past few days. Back on Saturday, I had a conversation with my Toys DBO and I brought up that he hasn't been meeting his push goal time and that he's been leaving a lot of leftover freight. I was especially on him since I'm confident in him being our store's best DBO who's been here for many several years and is usually reliable in terms of push, but I've just noticed that he hasn't been keeping up lately. He explained to me that he's burnt out and he openly told me that he's looking for a new job. He also said that he's been talking with other GM TM's and he's ascertained that they're feeling burnt out and overworked as well. He then goes on to tell me that this new rule with enforcing goal times is pissing off a lot of people and that the store is running the risk of losing a lot of team members in the coming months, specifically the long time veterans who have been here for years.

He also went on this giant tangent about how "arbitrary" that goal times are and how they don't take into account things like guest service, backing up other parts of the store, and just general limits on the human body. He also had another tangent about how TM's who promote to TL's are "sell outs" and that they get too wrapped up in the "Team Lead bubble" and forget about what it's like to be an actual DBO. He also told me that he liked me better as a regular TM and he told me that I should also start looking for a new job and that Target is on a downward trajectory. He had a lot that he clearly wanted to get off his chest and I let him vent. It was a conversation that had me slightly worried, but now I can't help but be just plain terrified right now.

I came into work today and my chem DBO called on the phone. He didn't just call out, but he also quit right there on the phone, no notice. On top of that, I overheard a conversation between my Kitchen and Stationary DBO's about how they're fed up with the workload and that they're both looking for new jobs. My zone defender for domestics snapped at me about feeling overworked and underappreciated, and I'm 99% certain that my pets DBO left early before the end of his shift today.

I brought all of this up to my GM ETL at the end of my shift and I was expecting her to have my back, but she instead got strict and gave a really ominous warning. She told me that if we start losing all of these bodies soon, then I'm going to have a reputation among ETL's as the GMTL who drove away all of our best and longest tenured TM's. I was trying really hard to hold my tongue and not snap at her that I've just been doing what she's been telling me to do in terms of enforcing the goal time. I'm just in a frustrated and even scared mood right now. I'm clearly losing the room for GM and I don't know what else can be done.

 

[NKG]

Welcome to being a new leader with out the leader skills to do your job. Unless you work WITH your team and produce results you unfortunately will be performance out.

 

[sunnydays]

you need to revisit all of this with your etl and explain this part:

I was trying really hard to hold my tongue and not snap at her that I've just been doing what she's been telling me to do in terms of enforcing the goal time

in a respectful way and ask what your next steps should be. explain that you've been trying to hold the team accountable while giving them a platform to air their grievances and feel heard and that the result is team members quitting, so what does she expect from you in terms of team member retention and recognition?

all team leads in every department are suffering like this in some respect. maybe not to the same extent as you, but by and large our teams are underpaid and overworked and how you try to retain that talent and keep them happy amidst what are frankly rapidly deteriorating circumstances is going to be something you (and a lot of other leaders chainwide, myself included) need to figure out....like, yesterday

 

[ohcomeon]

Welcome to being a new leader with out the leader skills to do your job. Unless you work WITH your team and produce results you unfortunately will be performance out.

So I'm the one who gets fired because others aren't coming clean? If my Toy DBO is failing to meet his goals, then it's him who should be fired, not me.

 

[60SecondsRemaining]

You take over as a new leader.

The team is clearly stressed.

Your first real leadership perogative (at the behest of your leadership) is to micromanage the shit out of your team.

If you were a TM, who has been struggling to finish work, and your new TLs response was to essentially micromanage you into oblivion, how would you react?

Your GMTL is a shit leader and you are following their shit example.

Did anyone ever stop to ask the question "why is every single person consistently failing to meet goals?". One person failing to meet goals is indicative of a problem with that person. The entire team failing to meet goals is indicative of a problem with the process or leadership, on in this case most likely the lack thereof.

Start there. Ask the team why they are struggling. Go and ask every single one of them personally. Then listen to their answer. Take that data and use it to generate some real solutions instead of "ur not goin fast enuf".

If your GM ETL and SD aren't ok with this, find a new job - they'll throw you under the bus and fire you before they ever admit their poor leadership is the cause of poor results.

 

[allnew2]

So I'm the one who gets fired because others aren't coming clean? If my Toy DBO is failing to meet his goals, then it's him who should be fired, not me.

Clearly you sound like you are in for yourself and not actually for the team . Anytime a dbo of mine failed to complete the workload I took the hit before they would . Next day I would talk to the team member and ask how can I help , what can I do. Micromanaging won’t work . Check in with your team and fallow up . If your toy dbo is struggling go and push a uboat with the dbo and connect with him/her. Maybe their sort is shit maybe the zone was so bad that now they have to spend extra 15-20, maybe doing a flex order for 30 minutes , maybe getting that electronics call that no one takes . Find the why before you coach . Take one for the team before you throw your team under the bus.

 

[ohcomeon]

You take over as a new leader.

The team is clearly stressed.

Your first real leadership perogative (at the behest of your leadership) is to micromanage the shit out of your team.

If you were a TM, who has been struggling to finish work, and your new TLs response was to essentially micromanage you into oblivion, how would you react?

Your GMTL is a shit leader and you are following their shit example.

Did anyone ever stop to ask the question "why is every single person consistently failing to meet goals?". One person failing to meet goals is indicative of a problem with that person. The entire team failing to meet goals is indicative of a problem with the process or leadership, on in this case most likely the lack thereof.

Start there. Ask the team why they are struggling. Go and ask every single one of them personally. Then listen to their answer. Take that data and use it to generate some real solutions instead of "ur not goin fast enuf".

If your GM ETL and SD aren't ok with this, find a new job - they'll throw you under the bus and fire you before they ever admit their poor leadership is the cause of poor results.

You have some nerve to be asking me that. I was a TM before being a lead. I know where I come from and I don’t need to imagine how I’d feel. I already know the feeling, thank you very much.

 

[60SecondsRemaining]

You have some nerve to be asking me that. I was a TM before being a lead. I know where I come from and I don’t need to imagine how I’d feel. I already know the feeling, thank you very much.

@CartoonPenguin is that you?

Best of luck my dude. Polish up the ol' resume because I have a sneaking suspicion papa's about to get bumped.

The pink slip. The stinky boot. The don't-let-the-door-hit-ya if you get my drift.

 

[REDcardJJ]

You have some nerve to be asking me that. I was a TM before being a lead. I know where I come from and I don’t need to imagine how I’d feel. I already know the feeling, thank you very much.

you ignored their entire post and cherry picked the part that hurt your fee fees

yikes

 

[allnew2]

You have some nerve to be asking me that. I was a TM before being a lead. I know where I come from and I don’t need to imagine how I’d feel. I already know the feeling, thank you very much.

With that being said you have nothing to bring to the table as a leader. You were a tm but you definitely lack in management. You supposed to elevate your team while you manage your team . Instead you are micromanaging and have no results

 

[allnew2]

you ignored their entire post and cherry picked the part that hurt your fee fees

yikes

Because he is in it for himself not to build a successful team. And his/her attitude shows that . Taking things way to personal

 

[Planosss]

I am always late to a good party.
GMTL, what were responses to your team concerns? Did you offer reasons ,methods and explain industry standards for these goal times? Did you offer reasonable concessions to account for guest service, trash, backstock? Did you observe the team to see if they are working efficiently to be able to achieve goal times?
OR,
Did you just stand there and listen and even agreed with the DBOs that goal times were not achievable?
If you did the later, unfortunately you have already lost the battle.
Your team will not look at you as a leader, if you are unable to offer answers, explanations,solutions and alternatives.

 

[MrT]

Theres a lot going on here so ill ask you a question? You like many others before you, including me, were probably a good tm promoted to lead with very little in actual training. How long have ago have you become a tl? Things dont get that bad that fast but they sure can escalate quickly. I disagree with allnew i think you are over your head being a new tl and you upper management would rather shift blame to you then realise they either caused the problem or at the very least missed the problem entirely. Everyone always gets mad when they start enforcing the goal times and productivity, especially if it hasnt been done in a while. Thats just the nature of the job and its what you have to do to save your own ass. My store has been largely successful especially relative to all the stores around me and i believe that has to do with the culture that has been created in the store. We get rid of the bad apples and work as a team. Good leadership makes or breaks a store and unfortunately yours seems to be the latter. Granted i dont want you to think this also isnt your fault you clearly have a lot to learn and there is a lot more to being a tl then a tm and most tms wont see that.

 

[Hardlinesmaster]

The op didn't listened on their other thread about tm's.

Do I have any say in the next TL promotion?

I'm a GM Team Leader who was promoted back in September. Before my promotion, I would occasionally butt heads with another GM Team Member whom we'll just refer to as "Jim". Even before I began my leadership development, I would try to take charge and establish myself as a leader whom other TM's...

www.thebreakroom.org

 

[Fluttervale]

So I'm the one who gets fired because others aren't coming clean? If my Toy DBO is failing to meet his goals, then it's him who should be fired, not me.

You’re the one who isn’t getting toys cleared. You could move someone who does get done to help him. You could do his cardboard and backstock for him. Are the vehicles sorted well? The goal times in Greenfield don’t include walking back and forth from the back room or backstockinh or cardboard. It’s only the time spent opening boxes and setting the product on the shelf.

 

[ohcomeon]

You’re the one who isn’t getting toys cleared. You could move someone who does get done to help him. You could do his cardboard and backstock for him. Are the vehicles sorted well? The goal times in Greenfield don’t include walking back and forth from the back room or backstockinh or cardboard. It’s only the time spent opening boxes and setting the product on the shelf.

I'm at the mercy of my ETL. I go where she tells me to go and that's as much as I can do.

 

[MrT]

I'm at the mercy of my ETL. I go where she tells me to go and that's as much as I can do.

I can understand that, but what have you done to find the problem and have you tried challenging them and offering solutions. Perhaps your leadership team isnt the best but what have you done to improve it.

 

[NKG]

So I'm the one who gets fired because others aren't coming clean? If my Toy DBO is failing to meet his goals, then it's him who should be fired, not me.

If you don't follow the steps to performance him out yes actually

 

[helloxbritty]

With that being said you have nothing to bring to the table as a leader. You were a tm but you definitely lack in management. You supposed to elevate your team while you manage your team . Instead you are micromanaging and have no results

This is the exact reason they look to hire externally for leadership

 

[seasonaldude]

Your job isn't just to manage. It's also to facilitate. If coporate goal times are being pushed on your DBOs, then you need to be frank with leadership about how realistic and unrealistic they are. It shouldn't be a shock that your stationary and kitchen DBOs want the fuck out. Official push times for Home are woefully inadequate most of the time. You should understand this as a former TM.

You need to go to your ETL and SD and say, "Look, we're not going to meet the push goals because stationary repacks take forever and a day. However, I am going to look into the DBO's current process and see if there are some adjustments we can make so that it goes faster than it currently is."

I.e., if you want your team to respect you and want to stay onboard, have their backs. Shield them from the bullshit and help facilitate them getting their work done.

 

[60SecondsRemaining]

I'm at the mercy of my ETL. I go where she tells me to go and that's as much as I can do.

When you were a TM your TL told you what to do, and you did it.

Now as a TL your ETL tells you what to go tell the TMs what to do.

There is no leadership here. You are not being a leader - this is why your team is leaving.

 

[commiecorvus]

I'm a GMTL who was promoted from GM Team member. The long story short is that my GM team doesn't like that my SD and GM ETL have started to become more strict about enforcing freight push goals. Me and other leaders have been keeping an extra close eye on the team in terms how long it takes for them to do their one-for-one's, when they start push, and how long they spend on a given vehicle.

To give a more thorough picture, I'll explain what's been going on the past few days. Back on Saturday, I had a conversation with my Toys DBO and I brought up that he hasn't been meeting his push goal time and that he's been leaving a lot of leftover freight. I was especially on him since I'm confident in him being our store's best DBO who's been here for many several years and is usually reliable in terms of push, but I've just noticed that he hasn't been keeping up lately. He explained to me that he's burnt out and he openly told me that he's looking for a new job. He also said that he's been talking with other GM TM's and he's ascertained that they're feeling burnt out and overworked as well. He then goes on to tell me that this new rule with enforcing goal times is pissing off a lot of people and that the store is running the risk of losing a lot of team members in the coming months, specifically the long time veterans who have been here for years.

He also went on this giant tangent about how "arbitrary" that goal times are and how they don't take into account things like guest service, backing up other parts of the store, and just general limits on the human body. He also had another tangent about how TM's who promote to TL's are "sell outs" and that they get too wrapped up in the "Team Lead bubble" and forget about what it's like to be an actual DBO. He also told me that he liked me better as a regular TM and he told me that I should also start looking for a new job and that Target is on a downward trajectory. He had a lot that he clearly wanted to get off his chest and I let him vent. It was a conversation that had me slightly worried, but now I can't help but be just plain terrified right now.

I came into work today and my chem DBO called on the phone. He didn't just call out, but he also quit right there on the phone, no notice. On top of that, I overheard a conversation between my Kitchen and Stationary DBO's about how they're fed up with the workload and that they're both looking for new jobs. My zone defender for domestics snapped at me about feeling overworked and underappreciated, and I'm 99% certain that my pets DBO left early before the end of his shift today.

I brought all of this up to my GM ETL at the end of my shift and I was expecting her to have my back, but she instead got strict and gave a really ominous warning. She told me that if we start losing all of these bodies soon, then I'm going to have a reputation among ETL's as the GMTL who drove away all of our best and longest tenured TM's. I was trying really hard to hold my tongue and not snap at her that I've just been doing what she's been telling me to do in terms of enforcing the goal time. I'm just in a frustrated and even scared mood right now. I'm clearly losing the room for GM and I don't know what else can be done.

I had a really long post based on my own experience running brigades as a chef but reading what all the posts here, it would have been mostly redundant.
You've been given some really good advice here.
What I really recommend is that you don't take any of it personally and that try to apply it immediately if not sooner.

You need to get in there with your crew and make sure they know you have their back.
You need to sit down with AUA (Assholes Up Above) and tell them you are on top of this.
Then make some plans to fix the problems.
If those plans don't work, then make some new ones and keep trying until you find one that does.

Empathy for your people goes a long way.
Make them know they are heard, don't fucking talk over them, keep your voice steady and calm.
Protect them from the AUA and help them get their work done.

Explain your plain to the AUA and if it doesn't work, explain the next one and why you think it will work better.
Same thing, be calm, be cool, be collected, not because you need empathy but because if they smell blood in the water they will eat you.

Meanwhile, kick ass and chew bubblegum, just like you are out of bubblegum.
You have to set an example of how hard and fast the team needs to be going.
If you aren't killing it, they won't see why they should be.

 

[Hal]

As a TM promote you need to act as the bridge. Yes you need to performance manage your team. But you also know what the expectations are and what is and is not reasonable to expect from your team. You need to be able to push back to your leaders.

I'm at the distribution center and my first day in role after training, I met with most of my team. That shift struggled in almost all of the performance factors and turnover was abysmal. At start up everyone looked dead in the eyes and miserable. As I stopped and talked to each one to introduce myself throughout the day every single one looked terrified when I approached because the previous manager (my partner at the time) had coached the shit out of them and was expecting me to also just continue yelling micromanaging.

I learned real fast the problem wasn't a performance problem. It was a culture problem. That's what you're facing. You can't measure culture in the performance factors but its the foundation of everything else. If the culture goes to shit, all your metrics go with it. Because if your team doesn't want to be there then why would they care about anything else?

You were also a TM. Think about what things you saw from your leaders that you liked and didn't like and start incorporating that into your approach. And be honest with your leaders. I told my boss almost the next day, culture is crap, I need to fix that. Its going to take time (I also needed to work out some bad eggs because my former partner loved performance documentation but refused to actually move on CA's and terms). In the meanwhile I needed them to be patient and let me work on what I needed to work on and gave them regular updates on my progress.

I ended that year with the best safety metrics in the building, turnover dropped, performance improved. And all that change simply came from a culture shift. People weren't miserable about coming to work. I didn't micromanage (and damn it was tempting sometimes) I clearly laid out my expectations, but I also let them know to tell me asap if there was something slowing them down because then I could either help or find help to fix it or explain to my boss that the miss wasn't there fault and we were working on fixing it.

TL;DR You got a culture problem. Talk to your team, level set expectations, and ask what they need. Be honest with your leaders and tell them what you need.

 

[ohcomeon]

As a TM promote you need to act as the bridge. Yes you need to performance manage your team. But you also know what the expectations are and what is and is not reasonable to expect from your team. You need to be able to push back to your leaders.

I'm at the distribution center and my first day in role after training, I met with most of my team. That shift struggled in almost all of the performance factors and turnover was abysmal. At start up everyone looked dead in the eyes and miserable. As I stopped and talked to each one to introduce myself throughout the day every single one looked terrified when I approached because the previous manager (my partner at the time) had coached the shit out of them and was expecting me to also just continue yelling micromanaging.

I learned real fast the problem wasn't a performance problem. It was a culture problem. That's what you're facing. You can't measure culture in the performance factors but its the foundation of everything else. If the culture goes to shit, all your metrics go with it. Because if your team doesn't want to be there then why would they care about anything else?

You were also a TM. Think about what things you saw from your leaders that you liked and didn't like and start incorporating that into your approach. And be honest with your leaders. I told my boss almost the next day, culture is crap, I need to fix that. Its going to take time (I also needed to work out some bad eggs because my former partner loved performance documentation but refused to actually move on CA's and terms). In the meanwhile I needed them to be patient and let me work on what I needed to work on and gave them regular updates on my progress.

I ended that year with the best safety metrics in the building, turnover dropped, performance improved. And all that change simply came from a culture shift. People weren't miserable about coming to work. I didn't micromanage (and damn it was tempting sometimes) I clearly laid out my expectations, but I also let them know to tell me asap if there was something slowing them down because then I could either help or find help to fix it or explain to my boss that the miss wasn't there fault and we were working on fixing it.

TL;DR You got a culture problem. Talk to your team, level set expectations, and ask what they need. Be honest with your leaders and tell them what you need.

I don’t think that fixing the culture is going to help us. Our backroom is a congested mess, filled with days worth of roll-over truck. We’ve resorted to pulling TM’s from other parts of the store (front end, Style, etc) to help push all of this roll-over and try to get us somewhat caught up.

 

[Xanatos]

I don’t think that fixing the culture is going to help us. Our backroom is a congested mess, filled with days worth of roll-over truck. We’ve resorted to pulling TM’s from other parts of the store (front end, Style, etc) to help push all of this roll-over and try to get us somewhat caught up.

I think they’re saying that an improvement in culture will is an improvement in morale, which should help motivate the team internally and give you the ability to motivate them externally without them wanting to quit.

Just to emphasize another point that other people have made - try to work alongside your team. Go push a u-boat with them. Pushing with them will help you gain their respect because you’re helping them out and you will be able to see exactly what they’re doing wrong and what they’re doing right. Maybe they aren’t moving fast enough. Maybe they are physically moving fast, but they aren’t doing things efficiently. Maybe things aren’t sorted. Maybe they consistently find defective things that they need to take care of, or some other weird issue slows them down and it’s something that is normal for them, but you haven’t experienced it.

Just to be clear - push WITH them, not for them. Don’t push by yourself; you can’t lead that way.