Archived ETL promotion possible without degree?

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I recently was promoted to Flow TL in Nov and was wondering what my career possibilities are after that. I have read multiple articles that state all ETLs require a 4 year degree which I do not have. My replen ETL says that you can get promoted to ETL if the DTL and STL really want you. I have the work experience (10 years with best buy SM, 8 years trader joes Captain(SM for those who do not know), and have a franchise under my belt (operated by wife). My question is it possible? My heart in is retail and enjoy working with people but if there is not opportunity for me to advance then I should look elsewhere (can go back to trader as 1st mate). I also would like to mention in the 6 months I have worked for target we have had 2 ETLs straight out of college with no work experience drive the hardlines and softlines into the ground. Education will never and has never trumped experience with anyone I have hired yet.
 
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I recently was promoted to Flow TL in Nov and was wondering what my career possibilities are after that. I have read multiple articles that state all ETLs require a 4 year degree which I do not have. My replen ETL says that you can get promoted to ETL if the DTL and STL really want you. I have the work experience (10 years with best buy SM, 8 years trader joes Captain(SM for those who do not know), and have a franchise under my belt (operated by wife). My question is it possible? My heart in is retail and enjoy working with people but if there is not opportunity for me to advance then I should look elsewhere (can go back to trader as 1st mate). I also would like to mention in the 6 months I have worked for target we have had 2 ETLs straight out of college with no work experience drive the hardlines and softlines into the ground. Education will never and has never trumped experience with anyone I have hired yet.

Your ETL is completely full of sh**.

Target will *not* promote you to ETL without a degree.

What your ETL is doing is called "carrot and stick management", and it is actually something they teach them in business college. In other words, he is putting a carrot (an ETL promotion) in front of your face to motivate you to work really really really hard so that someday "if they really want you", you just might make it to ETL with no degree.

In other words, it won't happen. You must have a degree. There are no exceptions.
 
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Not only do you have to have a degree....it cant be more then 5 years old. My district is pushing for no more then 2 years old now. Which I'm sorry but I think its HorseS***.
 

commiecorvus

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Yea, those of us with decades old and, I'm sure from Spots point of view, sinister degrees need not even try.
 
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Not only do you have to have a degree....it cant be more then 5 years old. My district is pushing for no more then 2 years old now. Which I'm sorry but I think its HorseS***.

This isn't accurate at all. I recently started as an external hire 12 years out of University. They have 2 departments of recruiters at HQ, one for recent grads and one all they look for is experienced candidates.

And sadly, the above posts about a degree being a mandate are correct. That ETL is trying to keep you sufficed most likely because he doesn't want to lose you. (Which is of course, cowardly and selfish)
 
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The degree thing really depends on if they want you. 2 team leads in my district and neighboring district have been promoted to etl and they have no degrees. It is possible but highly unlikely. I think a monkey can do a better job than some of these people with degrees...
 
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We had a few ETLs without college degrees a couple of years ago. Mysteriously these 2 ETLS, the ones you really worked hard for and had all of the best metrics in the store, were performances managed out. What we have now is fresh faced right out of college ETLS. Some are really good, some are using Target as a source of income until they find the career they really want. You will not be promoted to ETL without that degree. You are a TL for now, a Sr TL in the future and when they feel you are making too much $ you will be expendable.
 
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What you really have to look at is the place you live. The higher the percentage of the population that has degrees the less likely they are to promote without one. It does happen of couse but, it is pretty rare now. It is much cheaper to keep you a team lead and bring someone fresh out of college they can low ball because of lack of experience that way the get to keep you and have and ETL all on the cheap.
 
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The degree thing really depends on if they want you. 2 team leads in my district and neighboring district have been promoted to etl and they have no degrees. It is possible but highly unlikely. I think a monkey can do a better job than some of these people with degrees...

They have degrees. They might tell you (for what reason who knows) that they don't have a degree, but they do. OR you are getting this from a 3rd party that doesn't know what they have....
 
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promote up to srtl, learn all you can about being an lod--team development, scheduling, keys, security, the whole nine yards.
sign up for tuition reimbursement and go to school on target's dime (at least partly, anyway).
use your new knowledge to land you a better job where you can apply your experience.

don't hang out waiting for an etl spot---even if you get your degree. no degree--0% chance now. degree while already working at target--10% chance for internal hire. that's straight from the hr breakdown on sharepoint two years ago, and it's only gotten worse. it use to be, only new etls fresh out of school... now it's stls as well. we've hired 7 new stls in our district fresh out of college within the last year. all but one is gone. our store is the training center for newly hired folks. we're awesome because all our tls, 2 etls, and core tm have been with target for a decade and have outside mgmnt experience. yet, the team development specialists up top do not understand that retail is a game of experience rather than pretty faces. i jest somewhat, but it will be target's downfall once steinhaffel leaves with his millions and they dump the company into yet another moron's hands. however, judging from the dismal results with our upgrades, branding, marketing (especially online), and incompetent buyers, apparently this isn't just a trend within the stores, but across the company.
 
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The exception to the rule is that you must show you are working to get your degree. I have seen it happen before. It is very rare. You must be high performing, and have the DTL/HRBP sign off.
 
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The exception to the rule is that you must show you are working to get your degree. I have seen it happen before. It is very rare. You must be high performing, and have the DTL/HRBP sign off.

This is not correct.

If you "show you are working to get your degree" you can be an intern. You can not be an ETL until your degree has *actually* been conferred by your school.

Lots of people are "working" on their degree..... The vast majority of those people never graduate or even come close to graduating.
 
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"promote up to srtl, learn all you can about being an lod--team development, scheduling, keys, security, the whole nine yards.
sign up for tuition reimbursement and go to school on target's dime (at least partly, anyway)."

This is terrible advice. The odds of a TL/SrTL actually finishing their degree is almost impossible.

99% of stores will *not* work around a TLs/SrTLs school schedule. This means that you have to go to an online "school" like University of Phoenix or Devry. These are basically considered diploma mills to most employers (because they basically are) and most employers will throw your application in the trash immediately on seeing those schools listed.

Best option if you are actually serious about going to school and graduating? Quit target (or stay a TM with target working around school schedule), sign up for financial aid, take a full course load, and hit the books. This is what 99% of successful college students do. In most states, if you do well in your classes, you will get a decent amount of grant money that you won't have to pay back after graduation.

Oh, and make sure to major in something useful. That means science, math, technology, or engineering. Otherwise you are wasting your time. And FYI - don't even THINK about trying to get one of those degrees working full time. It won't happen.
 
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The exception to the rule is that you must show you are working to get your degree. I have seen it happen before. It is very rare. You must be high performing, and have the DTL/HRBP sign off.

This is not correct.

If you "show you are working to get your degree" you can be an intern. You can not be an ETL until your degree has *actually* been conferred by your school.

Lots of people are "working" on their degree..... The vast majority of those people never graduate or even come close to graduating.

This is wrong I know 2 people who have been moved up in the last two years who did not have degrees. They were working on them but, their was not time limit set for them to finish in regards to the their becoming ETLs. One has since finished and left Target the other has not and is still and ETL. Your percentage of ETLs without degrees has everything to do with local demographics of the population. Of course over the years I have know lots of TL that finished their degrees and quickly left Target.
 
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The exception to the rule is that you must show you are working to get your degree. I have seen it happen before. It is very rare. You must be high performing, and have the DTL/HRBP sign off.

This is not correct.

If you "show you are working to get your degree" you can be an intern. You can not be an ETL until your degree has *actually* been conferred by your school.

Lots of people are "working" on their degree..... The vast majority of those people never graduate or even come close to graduating.

This is wrong I know 2 people who have been moved up in the last two years who did not have degrees. They were working on them but, their was not time limit set for them to finish in regards to the their becoming ETLs. One has since finished and left Target the other has not and is still and ETL. Your percentage of ETLs without degrees has everything to do with local demographics of the population. Of course over the years I have know lots of TL that finished their degrees and quickly left Target.

What you don't seem to understand is that "working" on a degree doesn't mean a thing.

In California, you can be a high school drop out and enroll in community college even if you are not at all college ready. Technically, such a person is "working" on their degree..... they just won't ever get it.

Working on a degree and actually having one are two VERY different things. If Target actually let people who were "working" on a degree become ETLs, then anyone could just enroll in a college course and then qualify to be an ETL. Doesn't work that way.
 
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You do not need a degree to become an ETL. My Sr-Tl Log of 6 years was promoted last month to ETL-Log and has never even thought of going to college. If you have enough experience, do your job well, and have the right people behind you it is possible to become an ETL without a degree but highly unlikely. Our STL, DTL, and GL were all behind him and knew him personally, that is how he did it. Moral of the story, get in with the right people.
 

ptl

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The exception to the rule is that you must show you are working to get your degree. I have seen it happen before. It is very rare. You must be high performing, and have the DTL/HRBP sign off.

This is not correct.

If you "show you are working to get your degree" you can be an intern. You can not be an ETL until your degree has *actually* been conferred by your school.

Lots of people are "working" on their degree..... The vast majority of those people never graduate or even come close to graduating.

This is wrong I know 2 people who have been moved up in the last two years who did not have degrees. They were working on them but, their was not time limit set for them to finish in regards to the their becoming ETLs. One has since finished and left Target the other has not and is still and ETL. Your percentage of ETLs without degrees has everything to do with local demographics of the population. Of course over the years I have know lots of TL that finished their degrees and quickly left Target.

What you don't seem to understand is that "working" on a degree doesn't mean a thing.

In California, you can be a high school drop out and enroll in community college even if you are not at all college ready. Technically, such a person is "working" on their degree..... they just won't ever get it.

Working on a degree and actually having one are two VERY different things. If Target actually let people who were "working" on a degree become ETLs, then anyone could just enroll in a college course and then qualify to be an ETL. Doesn't work that way.

What you don't seem to understand is that you are the only person with the idea that letting someone become an ETL while "working on their degree" would mean letting anyone become an ETL as long as they were enrolled in a CC class. Nobody here except for you has even suggested that. On the contrary, people have pointed to examples--from their own actual experience--of people who, in the judgment of their DTLs, were worth promoting. Do you honestly believe that DTLs don't have enough gray matter to compare "taking an art history class at the CC" with "six credit hours from a University degree" and see the difference? Or do you think they just don't have the authority to decide that, while the first is obviously meaningless, the second may well be close enough to justify promoting a proven SrTL? News flash for you--they do have that gray matter, and they do have that authority.

Now, that being said, it's clearly much less likely to happen today than it was when the economy was firing on all cylinders. There are just too many qualified people out there, and the company clearly prioritizes actually-has-a-degree over actually-able-to-do-the-job. But in, say, a small, rural market, with the right DTL and the right SrTL, of course it could still happen.
 

nof

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I dont understand how you think its not possible to get a degree while working at target lol.

Get yourself into early morning flow tl, pricing or plano

Also many accredited universitys offer a lot of online courses..you just need the dedication to go through with some long hours between work and school. If you demonstrate you can do that as well as succesfully lead a team you'll definitely turn some heads...
 
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Our STL has no degree and isn't working on one. Our ETL-AP has no degree. I think he is taking classes but no degree yet.
 
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Our STL has no degree and isn't working on one. Our ETL-AP has no degree. I think he is taking classes but no degree yet.

You "THINK" he is taking classes but no degree yet. How do you know he doesn't already have one degree and is taking classes for another degree or more advanced degree like a masters? Just because he is taking classes doesn't mean he doesn't already have on degree, assuming he is even taking classes because you "think" that is what he is doing.

That's the problem here - all the people saying "Oh well my STL has no degree and he is an STL!" don't really KNOW what they actually have. You are just saying what you THINK they have or are doing.

Many people don't like bragging to people about having a degree. (FYI - going around telling or bragging to people you have a degree is not normal behavior, and many people could consider it rude) Some people simply don't think it is others business what level of education they have and will deny having a degree to avoid talking about it. I once worked with a TL who straight up told me once he didn't have any education beyond high school. About a few months after he got hired, he turned in his two weeks because he got a job as a professor at a university. Turned out he actually had a PhD. (the highest degree a person can get) When I asked him why he told me he didn't have anything beyond high school, he told me he couldn't risk people finding out because he had lied on his employment application about his education because he hadn't been able to get a job because employers were telling him he was overqualified. The fact is, unless you have direct access to a persons educational records you really don't know what they have.

But you know what guys? Go ahead and work really really really really hard so you can move up to ETL, because just like your ETL told you - all you need is hard work to become an ETL. Sure you can be an ETL with no degree. Or like you say buckwill, you can even be an STL with no degree! All you need is hard work. 10 years from now, when you are still busting your ass for that direct TM to STL promotion that you have coming because of your hard work, I'm sure your ETLs will tell you that the problem is that you haven't worked quite hard enough..... and that if you work just a litttllleee bit harder that STL promotion is going to be yours, in fact they may even tell you that you are working so hard all you need is a little more effort and in maybe 1 more year you'll move up to DTL!

(I am absolutely amazed how well carrot and stick management works..... whoever came up with this is probably a very rich person....)
 
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Our STL has no degree and isn't working on one. Our ETL-AP has no degree. I think he is taking classes but no degree yet.

You "THINK" he is taking classes but no degree yet. How do you know he doesn't already have one degree and is taking classes for another degree or more advanced degree like a masters? Just because he is taking classes doesn't mean he doesn't already have on degree, assuming he is even taking classes because you "think" that is what he is doing.

That's the problem here - all the people saying "Oh well my STL has no degree and he is an STL!" don't really KNOW what they actually have. You are just saying what you THINK they have or are doing.

Many people don't like bragging to people about having a degree. (FYI - going around telling or bragging to people you have a degree is not normal behavior, and many people could consider it rude) Some people simply don't think it is others business what level of education they have and will deny having a degree to avoid talking about it. I once worked with a TL who straight up told me once he didn't have any education beyond high school. About a few months after he got hired, he turned in his two weeks because he got a job as a professor at a university. Turned out he actually had a PhD. (the highest degree a person can get) When I asked him why he told me he didn't have anything beyond high school, he told me he couldn't risk people finding out because he had lied on his employment application about his education because he hadn't been able to get a job because employers were telling him he was overqualified. The fact is, unless you have direct access to a persons educational records you really don't know what they have.

But you know what guys? Go ahead and work really really really really hard so you can move up to ETL, because just like your ETL told you - all you need is hard work to become an ETL. Sure you can be an ETL with no degree. Or like you say buckwill, you can even be an STL with no degree! All you need is hard work. 10 years from now, when you are still busting your ass for that direct TM to STL promotion that you have coming because of your hard work, I'm sure your ETLs will tell you that the problem is that you haven't worked quite hard enough..... and that if you work just a litttllleee bit harder that STL promotion is going to be yours, in fact they may even tell you that you are working so hard all you need is a little more effort and in maybe 1 more year you'll move up to DTL!

(I am absolutely amazed how well carrot and stick management works..... whoever came up with this is probably a very rich person....)


This people is a very bitter, old man speaking out because things didn't work out quite like he planned in life...
 
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"promote up to srtl, learn all you can about being an lod--team development, scheduling, keys, security, the whole nine yards.
sign up for tuition reimbursement and go to school on target's dime (at least partly, anyway)."

This is terrible advice. The odds of a TL/SrTL actually finishing their degree is almost impossible.

99% of stores will *not* work around a TLs/SrTLs school schedule. This means that you have to go to an online "school" like University of Phoenix or Devry. These are basically considered diploma mills to most employers (because they basically are) and most employers will throw your application in the trash immediately on seeing those schools listed.

Best option if you are actually serious about going to school and graduating? Quit target (or stay a TM with target working around school schedule), sign up for financial aid, take a full course load, and hit the books. This is what 99% of successful college students do. In most states, if you do well in your classes, you will get a decent amount of grant money that you won't have to pay back after graduation.

Oh, and make sure to major in something useful. That means science, math, technology, or engineering. Otherwise you are wasting your time. And FYI - don't even THINK about trying to get one of those degrees working full time. It won't happen.

not true. our brtl, logtl, gsa, and ctl all are currently going to school. the log takes tues/thurs classes, br takes mwf classes in the afternoon, the ctl is split online/campus and is off on thursdays for her labs, and the gsa has two night classes and a sat am class in addition to her online classes. the best part SOT--the log is taking some kind of chemical engineering major (sorry-dont know much about it lol), and the ctl is a bio major hoping to pursue her masters and move down south. i also have a tm on my team that is currently enrolled for her masters degree in teaching, and i work around her observations/labs no prob. we just had another guy finish his teaching degree, leave several months to intern, and return to target while looking for a job in his field. he promoted almost immediately upon his return (they really wanna keep him). anyone can finish a degree if that is truly what they want, same as anyone can quit target if they really want to.
 
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"promote up to srtl, learn all you can about being an lod--team development, scheduling, keys, security, the whole nine yards.
sign up for tuition reimbursement and go to school on target's dime (at least partly, anyway)."

This is terrible advice. The odds of a TL/SrTL actually finishing their degree is almost impossible.

99% of stores will *not* work around a TLs/SrTLs school schedule. This means that you have to go to an online "school" like University of Phoenix or Devry. These are basically considered diploma mills to most employers (because they basically are) and most employers will throw your application in the trash immediately on seeing those schools listed.

Best option if you are actually serious about going to school and graduating? Quit target (or stay a TM with target working around school schedule), sign up for financial aid, take a full course load, and hit the books. This is what 99% of successful college students do. In most states, if you do well in your classes, you will get a decent amount of grant money that you won't have to pay back after graduation.

Oh, and make sure to major in something useful. That means science, math, technology, or engineering. Otherwise you are wasting your time. And FYI - don't even THINK about trying to get one of those degrees working full time. It won't happen.

not true. our brtl, logtl, gsa, and ctl all are currently going to school. the log takes tues/thurs classes, br takes mwf classes in the afternoon, the ctl is split online/campus and is off on thursdays for her labs, and the gsa has two night classes and a sat am class in addition to her online classes. the best part SOT--the log is taking some kind of chemical engineering major (sorry-dont know much about it lol), and the ctl is a bio major hoping to pursue her masters and move down south. i also have a tm on my team that is currently enrolled for her masters degree in teaching, and i work around her observations/labs no prob. we just had another guy finish his teaching degree, leave several months to intern, and return to target while looking for a job in his field. he promoted almost immediately upon his return (they really wanna keep him). anyone can finish a degree if that is truly what they want, same as anyone can quit target if they really want to.

Ok dude, you are right. You can be an ETL and even an STL or DTL with no degree. Happens all the time. Just keep up the good work and you'll be an ETL before you know it.
 
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Of course it's possible. I think we all know and agree that the most common ETL hire is straight out of college. Degreed TL/Sr. TL promotions would be second. Then you get into the "experienced, but may or may not be degreed" category. Like SOT said, VERY few people have any ability to sort truths from the mistruths/untruths.
 
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