Archived Need some advice...

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I've been working over nights at Target for a little over a year now as a regular team member. I was hired for the backroom, but it seems I'm used more as a global worker more then anything, so I don't really have a specific-designated area that I'm for sure going to work in. I would say I understand the culture of our over night team fairly well and I know how things are to be processed on the floor as well as the backroom. I would like to assume as well that everyone else has an understanding of our daily duties, how things should go, what needs to be done, what's going to be expected, etc.

I've come to a point where I feel like I'm confident enough to try and move up the chain of command, so as of early-August I've been trying to take some initiative with some leadership roles as well as other duties in attempt to obtain a Team Lead position (didn't have to be over night, in fact it didn't cross my mind since we didn't have any openings). Shortly after I started to shift my goals towards taking on more responsibilities and so forth an opening presented itself for a Team Lead position at our store for over nights. I've applied for it, I've asked for coaching from a fellow TL and even a ETL, and I'm patiently waiting for my interview to happen....

However, a problem that I feel is rather important has come up and it has started to make me second guess whether I should even go through with the TL interview process. Recently, one of the two over night ETL's was promoted to STL and because of that we obviously got a new over night ETL. The new ETL came from a HR position from a 4:00 AM store and has been with us since mid-August. She is a pretty strict leader (which is fine) and has a very different view and position on how she thinks everything should be run and conducted. She is more of a "worker-bee" type of boss, a "business" over all type of thinker, someone that just wants to see results, more specifically her results.

I personally have no issue with these types of people, but she is now saying and implying some not so friendly vocabulary to the team during our huddles. My over night team isn't a troubled team, of course we have our tough days when we receive double trucks or nights that exceed 3500 from pulls + truck, but we most often come clean. However, we don't come clean "fully" to her likening which we've never been imposed by any other ETL that has worked with us. Anyways, she was quick to threaten the entire team with different and undesired work shifts because our "brand" wasn't what it should be. She specifically pointed out and stated that the team can't leave until everything is done: this includes making bales, sweeping all of the backroom, receiving, around the balers, the compactor, stacking cages, making sure the line is free from any clutter, back stock done, etc. You know, just tidying everything up. Everything which is pretty much done, but as 4th quarter nears with larger and larger trucks and larger and larger pulls, and with out any seasonal hires, it's straining our team greatly and we can't always sweep in the less "important" areas such as around the bale or receiving and so forth.

It was a threat, simple as that. She mentioned the consequence for the action and now that threat has come into fruition.

I see her "plan" as possible goals, things we can strive to achieve, but that will require certain things to be changed during the night with the team. I've traced it back to a simple logistical issue, if the team is more efficient and effective in certain areas, that will free up time for us to get to those end-of-night tasks. However, it's clear she is very much lacking in the logistical background.

This is just but the beginning of issues, from here things have started to really spiral down hill. Some of the team viewed this as her nit-picking at issues that weren't exactly deemed as a critical and vital issue, so the team in result has started to nit-pick back at her under qualifying duties. Sadly, I'm to blame for this kind of action too, but I'm sure anyone can realize that this isn't going to end well or even procure a healthy and respectable relationship within the team. Since she is scrutinizing the team, the team talks behind her back, mostly criticizing herself as an ETL. Some individuals take these matters to TL's (myself included) and others to the other ETL (which I have also done), but I'm not sure anyone even confronts her about the issues because of who she is.

A lot of the backroom members have pretty much dismissed her and I'm getting to that point myself. She is essentially making everyone's jobs harder because she is applying unneeded and undesired pressure upon the team. I also think one of the key issues as to why people can't approach her so easily is because she doesn't even take the time to get to know her team. She loops around the store shortly after the truck is done, but she never greets anyone unless she is greeted too (this could be a slight exaggeration, she may in fact greet some people but it's been a known issue amongst MANY TMs) and doesn't even take the time to ask how your day is going and so forth. Essentially, there is no acknowledgement that she even exists to you besides her walking around the floor and then of course at break.

Personally, I feel like this is a huge issue because it devalues trust and respect in oneself, which creates a lack of motivation and desire to even work for her. This was actually a complaint I brought up with my other ETL. I'm not asking that she become friends with me, I know I can't be friends with her, I don't even really want her to know that much about me. It's the perception that she actually cares, she's taking time to acknowledge that this TM is here, this TM is over there, this TM's birthday is tomorrow or something...it feels like because she doesn't do ANY of this that she is greatly disconnected from the actual culture of the over night team.

I can't see how this isn't an important aspect of the job, am I wrong? Personally, I'm starting to resent her because she is a busy-body, a robot in sense. Sorry, I'm ranting/venting...I'll try and wrap this up to my point/question.

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These are just some of the key concerns, obviously there are more, but some of them can be dismissed or be fought another day. The problem I'm having is that I see the team and I see how much less they actually work when she is on duty compared to the other ETL. I feel like some of the key concerns are very real reasons as to why things are starting to feel...tense and hostile with her. When I approached the other over night ETL about these issues, she presented them to her and then followed up with me. I had to pry the answer out of her, but what I basically got was that she wasn't there to be anyone's friend and that people will respect her for her business style. She puts business over everything essentially. Just blows my mind that anyone can think like this while trying to manage a team like over nights....

Anyways, this concern apparently was just recently brought up again by other team members and I over heard my other over night ETL complaining in the TSC (I was at a locker) about how she isn't willing to change. I also over heard that the problematic ETL felt like there was no one worthy to even be a TL for this team (including the current TL's we had except 1 of them). Personally, that was a huge demoralizing blow to myself, but even more importantly, she didn't seem to want to change for the team. It almost feels like she is personally trying to jockey herself for a position to get out of over nights, I'm not sure....

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So here is the thing. I really want that TL position, I feel confident in my skills, but this issue has really made me second guess everything. Especially after what I over heard. Talk about being at the wrong place at the wrong time ;\ I'm able to work with her, but I'm not sure how much I could actually tolerate of her ideology and methodology on how the team should be run if I actually became a TL. Which, has been and was running quite well before she was even ETL or even at this store for that matter. It's hard to feel good about myself when she thinks that I can't even do the job. I've brought the issue to my ETL, it seems she has made an active attempt at trying to resolve the issue, but still nothing.

I want to take it to the head store manager, but I'm worried if I complain about such an issue at this time that it could possibly hurt or damage my attempt at becoming a over night TL. That's probably my biggest worry. I've tried to convince myself that it could demonstrate courage and the ability to try and solve issues and so forth, but I don't know. I also look at it as just another TM complaining about things that they don't like about their job....

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Any advice on how I should approach this situation further? If I should even go to the head store manager with these issues? If I should approach the ETL directly about the issues? Back off for now? I don't feel like holding these thoughts, ideas, and emotions in is a good idea, especially as a TM attempting to go for a TL position. I don't think that really demonstrates qualities of a good TL....I want to resolve the issue, but, ugh....



I'm sorry for the rant/vent, but I'm hoping someone can share something with me on this issue.

Side note: I don't even think she knows my name, at least I get that feeling... Also, the first two weeks she was here I attempted to make conversation with her, which didn't always work. After that, I stopped even greeting her since she was never initiating a simple "Hello" to me. We've been in this state of no communication except at huddles ever since...
 

commiecorvus

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Yea, if you want that TL position, there's no way you want to do any complaining about the ETL.
Whose been filling the TL role till now and do you communicate much with them?
Do they get along with her and can they communicate with her?
The problem with overnight teams is you're in another world and there isn't the overlap where other TL or ETL might be able to run interference.

Ultimately it sounds like you've got somebody who knows what needs to be done but doesn't have the skills to manage people to get it done.
 
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There has been no one filling in the TL position, the other 3 TLs have been picking up the extra slack. What's more mind boggling is that it was this very ETL that said she wanted a speedy process in filling the role. Which she then encouraged team members to apply for it, only to go behind everyone's backs and say that she thinks no one is suitable for the position...?

You said it well though, she does seem to know what needs to be done (even if her process is a bit more strict, doesn't matter), however she sucks at managing and dealing with people. It's almost like she is creating a rift or divide in the team, everything seems to go so much more poorly with her around or she is a non-factor and everything ends up falling onto the TL's.
 
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You might need to wait her out....because if she is trash talking you behind your back now, she will not support you at all as a TL.
 

DMNDZ bruhh

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i would still apply for it, dont even let her know, let your STL know, thats if you are on good terms with your STL

after you apply, tell your STL that you applied and that you are looking forward to a possible opportunity working along side with the other leadership in the store, including this ETL you are talking about. that shows your STL that you aren't like the others who are complaining about. hell, if you see your DTL every so often, S up a conversation with them and let them know about you applying for the position, there words meen everything to the store leadership.

trust me, all TLs, ETLs, and STLs talk, they know the bad ones from the good, and it sounds like this one is a bad one
 
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I've already applied for it. The opening closed 9 days ago, so I'm waiting on my interview now.

Unfortunately, the ETL that doesn't seem to be getting along too well with others, because she wants it her way or no way, already knows that I'm going for the TL position. Which, I over heard she doesn't approve of me (she doesn't approve of anyone on the team being a team leader--glad she can make that call for only being here for 2 months lol) ;\ Regardless, I already asked my other O/N ETL for some coaching and have received it, she see seems to support me, which is great. However, with this issue becoming more of a problem every single day, it has made me second guess whether I would actually be able to put up with her barking her nonsense at me when I know she's dumb as a bat and just creating more work then needed. Something I like to preach, "worker smarter, not harder"...

Anyways, that's why I brought up the issue in itself, seeing if it was wise to even go to my head store manager to talk about the issue before I actually interview with him for the TL position.
 
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This is your chance. Work with the O/N leader that does support you and get yourself prepared. Knock them out during the interview and give 110% to be the best TL you can. Focus on how good it'll feel when you prove her wrong.
 
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Well, I had two interviews so far. I guess there are three packets, so I'm waiting for the last one and then possibly a DTL interview if I'm advanced on.

Honestly, a lot of these questions are terrible for the position lol. I understand as a TL there are duties and responsibilities that I may be asked to perform if the circumstances presented itself to me, but the chances of that happening are slim to none. Regardless though, most of the questions were about guest satisfaction, cashiering, add-on items, etc. How do any of these questions have anything to do with how well I can lead and manage a team to push the floor? I think of the 8 questions I've been asked thus far, only two could be applied to the actual job. I'm now worrying about not receiving this job because of the actual questions, not my answers. It's no wonder why 2 of my current team leads are so weak in the logistical process if this is the kind of interview process they had to go through with. Who knows, I could just be blowing smoke and the last packet is all about things that can pertain to the actual job and its duties...
 

mrknownothing

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If, by some strange and rather unfortunate turn of events, your store changed from overnight to early morning process, the guest service items might be of some use.
 
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If, by some strange and rather unfortunate turn of events, your store changed from overnight to early morning process, the guest service items might be of some use.

I completely understood the reasoning for them to be asked, because of instances like this or say on Black Friday, midnight releases, etc.
However, why are more then half the questions (thus far) tailored to guest satisfaction opposed to the actual job? Besides for my TM interview, I have no idea what all the other interview packets are like, but I'm starting to assume that the interview for any TL position is the same regardless of the department you're applying for...? Just seemed a bit, wasteful. How hard is it to come up with questions tailored to your specific role? Add those on top of these. Again, I could be speaking too soon since I still have 1 more interview.
 
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