Archived Call Out/ Late Point system

[Amaazingdude]

How would everyone feel if Target went to a Point Program like Walmart? For example if you get to 10 points in a period of time you're fired. Clocking in late is a x amount of points, calling out is x amount of points , NCNS is X amount of points.

 

[redeye58]

Too rigid; doesn't seem to allow much for variables.
Think you'd end up losing a lot of good TMs & the bad ones would figure out how to game the system.
Biggest problem? It wouldn't be implemented evenly/fairly.

 

[Xanatos]

My store started doing something similar. 2 lates = coaching. 1 call off = coaching. NCNS = CCA. 4 coachings in any 4 week period = CCA. And it doesn't take much to take a CCA to a Final and then to get fired.

I think it's too lenient though. You could have 3 call offs per month without worrying about losing your job, unless my leaders change the interpretation and allow us to look back the last couple of months. That's close to a call off per week and the only real consequence would be that your raise might be a few cents less at the end of the year.

 

[Firefox]

1 call off = coaching

I don't like things like that. There are plenty of times that calling off is completely warranted, which is why I'm glad we don't have a standardized policy in regards to attendance. I think it also kinda depends what workcenter the person was scheduled. If a cashier calls out, it's not the end of the world. But the closing GSA/Electronics/BRTM? That might require a coaching just because of how much they are relied on.

 

[Kartman]

I like it.

 

[Xanatos]

I don't like things like that. There are plenty of times that calling off is completely warranted, which is why I'm glad we don't have a standardized policy in regards to attendance. I think it also kinda depends what workcenter the person was scheduled. If a cashier calls out, it's not the end of the world. But the closing GSA/Electronics/BRTM? That might require a coaching just because of how much they are relied on.

True, but it's just a coaching. Some call offs are legit, which is why you don't get fired for having just one. As I said in my post, you could almost call off once per week and still have a job. A single coaching doesn't mean much. We just started doing this and I've already coached several TMs and I always tell them that they are not in danger of losing their job, we just want to make sure they know how important it is to show up for work and how much it can affect the rest of the store. If they only call off once, then this coaching basically means nothing. But if it happens several more times, we want to make sure we are holding you accountable from the start.

 

[Firefox]

True, but it's just a coaching. Some call offs are legit, which is why you don't get fired for having just one. As I said in my post, you could almost call off once per week and still have a job. A single coaching doesn't mean much. We just started doing this and I've already coached several TMs and I always tell them that they are not in danger of losing their job, we just want to make sure they know how important it is to show up for work and how much it can affect the rest of the store. If they only call off once, then this coaching basically means nothing. But if it happens several more times, we want to make sure we are holding you accountable from the start.

Oh for sure. But most TMs at my store think of being coached as being written up, so if Leadership initiated a policy like that at my store everyone would probably start walking on egg shells.

 

[SFSFun]

We have a defined system like that at my other job, and while it's annoying how rigid it is, I do think it helps (for the most part).

It goes like this:

Absences:
2 - verbal warning
4 - written warning
6 - final warning
7 - fired
It's based on a rolling 365-day period, and an NCNS counts as two absences.

Tardiness (6+ minutes late):
7 - verbal warning
9 - written warning
11 - final warning
12 - fired
Also based on a rolling 365-day period.

The absences seem kind of strict, but it is extremely easy to get it excused. You can turn in a doctors note, use sick pay or a personal day if you have those, or you can even just use vacation pay. Many of the long term, full-time employees get several weeks of vacation, and they use it to call off and get an excused absence for any unfavorable shift they get.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, that after every tardy or absence, a note goes into the program they use to track it and a sheet of paper is printed and given to the employee that lists the shift and what time they clocked in or called off, and it lists how many absences and tardys they currently have.

 

[jenna]

I don't like things like that. There are plenty of times that calling off is completely warranted, which is why I'm glad we don't have a standardized policy in regards to attendance. I think it also kinda depends what workcenter the person was scheduled. If a cashier calls out, it's not the end of the world. But the closing GSA/Electronics/BRTM? That might require a coaching just because of how much they are relied on.

uh. nope.

why should cashiers have more leeway? A cashier calls out, and that puts strain on the salesfloor.

I think it should be based upon the number of callouts & whether they are "excused" due to illness (Dr's note,) legit death in the family, jury duty, weather (snowpocolypse) etc.

 

[jenna]

I don't think this would be enforced fairly. I think some team members would skate by, and others who are disliked (for whatever reason) would be pushed out.

 

[BadWolf4531]

uh. nope.

why should cashiers have more leeway? A cashier calls out, and that puts strain on the salesfloor.

I think it should be based upon the number of callouts & whether they are "excused" due to illness (Dr's note,) legit death in the family, jury duty, weather (snowpocolypse) etc.

Cashiers shouldn't have more leeway when it comes to an attendance policy, but let's face it: it's way tougher to cover callouts in specialized work centers like GSA, Backroom, Deli, etc. (don't even get me started on Cash Office). If I couldn't fire a team member with attendance issues, then I'd at least want them to be a cashier or Flow TM rather than in one of these areas.

 

[Firefox]

uh. nope.

why should cashiers have more leeway? A cashier calls out, and that puts strain on the salesfloor.

I think it should be based upon the number of callouts & whether they are "excused" due to illness (Dr's note,) legit death in the family, jury duty, weather (snowpocolypse) etc.

Because more is excpected of the GSA and I imagine electronics. GSA is a developmental role at most stores to showcase leadership skills, so your are held to a higher standard than a cashier or cart attendant. If your closing GSA calls out, it create an infinite number of problems for the LOD, and it's very difficult to cover that loss whereas a cashier is more easily replaced and easier to make do without. I'm not saying that GSAs should be more harshly punished, just that I would definitely coach a GSA who calls our but perhaps not a cashier because it doesn't cause nearly as much headcahe.

 

[tellmeaboutatime]

Um, our entire TL staff would be on corrective action. Not one of them is ever on time. If they went to a point system it should be enforced evenly across the board.
When anyone calls out,especially now during the payroll crunch, every single position is crucial. One call off anywhere affects everyone.

 

[MasterofLOG]

[QUOTE="mathprofmatt, post: 260289, member: 5389" If I couldn't fire a team member with attendance issues, then I'd at least want them to be a cashier or Flow TM rather than in one of these areas.[/QUOTE]


WOOOOOOOOOO Hold it right there! CO and/or NCNS is a HUGE problem on Flow! The whole setup relies on EVERY TM being there. Period. Especially in areas like ELEC, scanner, and for us GROC/FDC.

This is why having back ups for positions like ELEC is crucial, BUT when you start rearranging the pieces on the board for CO/NCNS some things impact the game more than others... Example:

If the MAIN ELEC person calls out/vac/ncns then the backup #1 is out of TOYS, thus TOYS needs a replacement or it sits till the end of the process.. to be done by SFTL or moving others from the WAVE.If I have TWO missing ELEC that impacts WAV of CHEM, PETS, and FDC...

This is a ripple effect and missing TM on Flow is not just plug in a body!

And YES I am in LOG and deal with FLOW DAILY. I know the effects of vacation, CO, NCNS, jury duty, etc..

And SF call outs effect MY FLOW as well....

Cafe not there? Guess who has the ex-TL-CAFE on their team? Missing a cashier, guess what bodies they start trying to steal EARLY to fill? Same with a few SF spots like SFT and Market/Consumables (the secondary PA is a primary FLOW TM.) Same with other WC stealing my TM for other WC... Price Change.. guess who has the backups and rock stars too? You got it! And that effects FDC and SFTL. Instocks? Ditto. Backroom, Ditto, Cart Attendant, Yeppers again.. my team has the backups which snatch up these shifts from swaps etc. and get interrupted to do carts because we don't schedule one till 1300 on a SAT or CO/NCNS etc..

Cashiers missing means that the remaining cashiers needs to STEP UP Buttercup! I regularly have and do backup and the pace of cashiers ALIMS is HORRIBLE! I see horrible RED Scores on the screens and the reports regularly... which results in interminable calls for fast service... when a few rock star cashiers would prevent that OR a GSTL with the same level of management as the previous SrGSTL (All promoted out). Yes I know it sucks as a cashier... and plain and simple when I do it, you can take your Red card harassment and stick it! I will not molest guests for it! I am there to do what the GUEST WANTS. Check them out FAST! Friendly, BUT FAST!, Fun, but FAST! No RC nonsense!

CO/NCNS have a ripple effect down the line... some areas like Flow, Cafe, Operator have larger ripples and consequences.

 

[jenna]

If you have a GSA that constantly calls out, then maybe they shouldn't be a GSA.

A coaching for one legit call out is ridiculous, regardless of the work center.

 

[Xanatos]

If you have a GSA that constantly calls out, then maybe they shouldn't be a GSA.

A coaching for one legit call out is ridiculous, regardless of the work center.

Coaching doesn't actually do anything, though, which is why some of us are okay with it. It takes several coachings to build up to a CCA. A CCA is what people should get worried about, but even that doesn't put you in jeopardy of losing your job. The ETL-AP and a GSTL in my store are both on final warnings and they still aren't freaking out about losing their job, they just stopped doing the stupid shit that got them on the final.

 

[3LetterDevil]

Personally, I like the point system. Less chance of absences being "overlooked" by TLs/ETLs who favor certain TMs.

 

[sher]

I would've been jobless by all these systems that time I was sickly. And probably when I first started and didn't get the whole NJTransit is always late memo. I got coached twice back then but it was much more lenient than these systems you guys got going on. During the talks, I told my srTL my scheduling wishes and for a while she did what I asked. Was very helpful. I figured out a bus routine (gotta take the one that makes me an hr early. 2hrs if I have to hike le snow) and all was well.

Also never heard that you could apply time to your lateness at Target. That doesn't seem like something that's real...

 

[mandie89]

We had a points system at my last job. Didn't work because some employees were always calling out or coming in late but no action was taken once they exceeded like, six or seven points.

 

[buliSBI]

I had one store that did an unofficial 3 call outs in a 3 month period before a coaching. Usually if there was a sickness going around or if you had kids, management would be more understandable. A doctors note would help excuse some as well.

 

[Bosch]

Tardy - You would have to have leadership who actually open the door on time. HR stopped looking at process teams sine we are always 6+ min late to start.

 

[Stubio]

Won't happen, the people who would get fired for calling out late too many times would just skirt right below the maximum.
They usually won't work long enough for a review to point this out to them.

 

[Amaazingdude]

The point system will get rid of the lazy team members.

 

[thetargetman]

If people want a point system then everyone should be willing to live by the same rules. TMs TLs, Sr.TLs! and no "letting people slide"

 

[RedorBlue]

How would everyone feel if Target went to a Point Program like Walmart? For example if you get to 10 points in a period of time you're fired. Clocking in late is a x amount of points, calling out is x amount of points , NCNS is X amount of points.

It's not exactly like this.

3 occurrences gets you a verbal (active 6 months)
+ 1 occurrence and a verbal = 1st write up (active 1 year)
+ 1 occurrence and 1st write up = 2nd write up (active 1 year)
+ 1 occurrence and 2nd write up = final (active 1 year)
+ 1 occurrence and final = termed

1 Occurrence is described as 1 call out, late/left early more then 50% of shift, or 3 tardys.

If a TM was on a verbal (6 month standing), and they call out on day 6 months + 1 day = the process starts all over again.

If TM is sick for 2-3 days in a row, this counts as 1 occurrence.

NCNS = 2 written automatically

Walmarts write up system is different from other companies. All write ups are grouped together no matter what the "topic" is; attendance, performance and grey area.

So if you are on a first level write up for attendance and you do something that warrants a write up other than attendance (performance), you will go to a final.

There is a lot of grey area for interpretation and managers do not keep up on this. I've seen TMs get away with 9 occurrences during the busy holidays before they would get out on a verbal. If the TM calls out repeatedly before a manager can document a conversation with TM, the TM gets away with "freebies".

I've gone into new stores and have seen entire management staff interpret the policy wrong and TM were getting written up for occurrences that should have been lumped together - all in all this policy is a mess and you don't want it.

References: myself, previous Walky world HR manager.