Archived Gap raises its minimum wage to $10/ hr over next two years

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They want to make the most money while spending the least amount of money and they also want to accomplish that without having to make any sacrifices financially for themselves.

I kind of think that if I owned a business I'd have the same attitude. I don't begrudge them a lot of their fiscal decisions, but I do think that they need to remember to factor in the well-being of their employees when looking at "least amount" of money. They wouldn't be the business they are without the employee.
 
If everyone uses the same idea, you're basically in the same boat.
To get ahead, your business has to stand out.
Target's stand-outs used to be cheap chic, quirky ads, low prices, clean stores & STELLAR guest service.
With the loss of virtually all of those, we've become a pseudo-Wally world.
 
Hello,

My work center on the battlefield is Presentation.
I earn $9.73 an hour.
Will this July minimum wage hike be raising my pay to $10.73 ?
Thanks in advance for any information.
 
Hello,

My work center on the battlefield is Presentation.
I earn $9.73 an hour.
Will this July minimum wage hike be raising my pay to $10.73 ?
Thanks in advance for any information.

I suspect everyone who is making minimum wage will get the boost to it and anybody who gets marginalized will get a dime above.
It should be fun to see how things go in Seattle.
 
The downsides of minimum wage laws outweigh any benefits, but fortunately for legislators, beneficiaries, and corporations, most of those downsides are left unseen or go unnoticed because they are so interwoven in the economy. Mainly, what results is less workers, cut from at the bottom of the ladder (mostly young kids working their first job), and slight price inflation, while some smaller businesses lose out and are eventually squashed by their corporate overlords.

It's all gradual, and the effects, while negative, are somewhat marginal to a point. In a year's time, there's nothing major to observe, but keep raising the minimum wage and over the course of many years, you might begin to wonder why things just seem to get progressively worse. Then of course you'll demand for another minimum wage hike.
 
Thanks for the input commiecorvus.
My TL was as dismayed as me at how low the pay raise was for members on our team, and said that there would be a rise of $1 hr in July. When I asked if she was 100% sure it would bump non minimum wages equally she said she would look into it.
Last year the raise was nearly double than that of of this year and my performance/productivity and responsibilities have increased since then.
 
The downsides of minimum wage laws outweigh any benefits, but fortunately for legislators, beneficiaries, and corporations, most of those downsides are left unseen or go unnoticed because they are so interwoven in the economy. Mainly, what results is less workers, cut from at the bottom of the ladder (mostly young kids working their first job), and slight price inflation, while some smaller businesses lose out and are eventually squashed by their corporate overlords.

It's all gradual, and the effects, while negative, are somewhat marginal to a point. In a year's time, there's nothing major to observe, but keep raising the minimum wage and over the course of many years, you might begin to wonder why things just seem to get progressively worse. Then of course you'll demand for another minimum wage hike.

This has been proved to be wrong.
In fact by keeping the minimum wage low it hurts the small business owner because the big companies are able to hire huge numbers of people and use the government to support them through food stamps and Medicare.
This article show that states where they raised the minimum wage actually increased business to small companies.
The whole argument that kids would lose out ignores the fact that anymore the highest percentage of people on minimum wage are adults.

http://www.businessinsider.com/raising-minimum-wage-small-businesses-retail-2013-2

While the 40 states without a higher minimum wage saw a contraction in the number of establishments, states with a higher minimum wage saw slight growth.

Even more, small businesses in states with higher minimum wage performed better in all categories.

The prevailing wisdom that higher wages hurts small business owners doesn't really hold up.
 
The important part is that there will be more money in the system, the will be used to buy things that are needed by the people, thus more activity in the markets and then more jobs will be created, not less.
If all that matters is having more money in the system, why not give everyone a newly minted 5000 dollar bill?
 
The important part is that there will be more money in the system, the will be used to buy things that are needed by the people, thus more activity in the markets and then more jobs will be created, not less.
If all that matters is having more money in the system, why not give everyone a newly minted 5000 dollar bill?

Standard reductio ad absurdum argument.
Thanks for playing but you don't get any cheese.
 
Some states have minimum wage exemptions for small businesses. If a business makes less than X amount per year, they can pay less than minimum wage.

What I don't get is why people who get tips get lower than minimum wage, and that this is spelled out in the labor laws. I don't understand that. It's f***ing stupid. Tips are money the business was never going to see, so who cares? The business provides a service, has a price for that service, the price is paid by the patron as spelled out on the bill, and that's that. Nice, simple transaction. So, what's with all the whining about how much they make in tips, so much so that there needs to be a law to bring the worker down? "Wages plus tips will equal minimum wage, so it's ok" is weak as f*** as a "reason".
 
Some states have minimum wage exemptions for small businesses. If a business makes less than X amount per year, they can pay less than minimum wage.

What I don't get is why people who get tips get lower than minimum wage, and that this is spelled out in the labor laws. I don't understand that. It's f***ing stupid. Tips are money the business was never going to see, so who cares? The business provides a service, has a price for that service, the price is paid by the patron as spelled out on the bill, and that's that. Nice, simple transaction. So, what's with all the whining about how much they make in tips, so much so that there needs to be a law to bring the worker down? "Wages plus tips will equal minimum wage, so it's ok" is weak as f*** as a "reason".

And that lower wage has been the same since the early 90's.
The servers get taxed on the tips even if they don't get them, which is why I tip even if the service is mediocre.
If it's bad I talk to the manager and get it taken care of right there.
In Hawaii since the have a lot of tourists from other countries where tipping is not common, they are working on raising the wage for servers to a living wage (which is high for the islands) and getting rid of tipping all together.
 
In fact by keeping the minimum wage low it hurts the small business owner because the big companies are able to hire huge numbers of people
And...
and use the government to support them through food stamps and Medicare.
Corporations get a lot more support from the government than just that. My position is to keep government separate from business completely, so all you have to work with is that big companies can hire huge numbers of people. Not much of an argument there.
The whole argument that kids would lose out ignores the fact that anymore the highest percentage of people on minimum wage are adults.
"According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics there are about 3.6 million workers at or below the minimum wage (you can be below legally under certain conditions). That is 2.5 percent of all workers and 1.5 percent of the population of potential workers. Within that small group, 31 percent are teenagers and 55 percent are 25 years old or younger. That leaves only about 1.1 percent of all workers over 25 and 0.8 percent of all Americans over 25 earning the minimum wage."

Guess it depends on how you define adult. For the most part, first earners in households are not working for minimum wage.
Correlation =/= causation. Not sure there's much here worth my time, given the source. But if you'd like, I'll write a proper rebuttal later.
 
The E.P.I. has a few numbers on the raising of the minimum wage as well.

  • The average age of affected workers is 35 years old;
  • 88 percent of all affected workers are at least 20 years old;
  • 35.5 percent are at least 40 years old;
  • 56 percent are women;
  • 28 percent have children;
  • 55 percent work full-time (35 hours per week or more);
  • 44 percent have at least some college experience.
http://www.epi.org/publication/wage-workers-older-88-percent-workers-benefit/

Guess it depends on how you define adult. For the most part, first earners in households are not working for minimum wage.

First earner?
Most of the people I know who worked at Target couldn't afford to live on one income or even two.
If they had kids many of them had two jobs and their partners had that many or more.
And these were people who had worked for the company for a while so how could people work for minimum wage be counted as first, second or third earners?

We need a living wage in this country.
 
Standard reductio ad absurdum argument.
Reductio ad absurdum isn't a logical fallacy though. You said that more money in the system means more spending. Where do you draw the line between the right amount and the wrong amount?

The same line that debate goes from being reasonable to trolling.
 
Higher minimum wage is better at every level of economy. Exhibit A: Australia. Exhibit B: Washington. Exhibit C: San Francisco. I rest my case.
 
Standard reductio ad absurdum argument.
Reductio ad absurdum isn't a logical fallacy though. You said that more money in the system means more spending. Where do you draw the line between the right amount and the wrong amount?

The same line that debate goes from being reasonable to trolling.
Hey now, I could say the same of you for posting links to business insider and union backed think tanks. It's a legitimate argument and I asked a legitimate question. Where does it become too much, and why?
 
t sounds selfish but hey this is America and America is a business first, country second.
Huh?
 
I come from a state that doesn't have a state income tax and give a yearly dividend to every resident from the permanent fund the state set up back in the 80s.
It's certainly not possible for every state but it works there.

People look forward to that check every year, it's a cause for celebration.
I was working poor, lived in a trailer park and robbed Peter to pay Paul.
When I got those checks I'd pay my back bills, try to get caught up, maybe replace the worn out tires on my wife's car, fix the roof that was leaking.
But that money didn't really go into the economy.
It didn't help the economy on a daily basis, most of it went out of state or to the bank.
The working poor don't need one check, even for $5,000.

They need a living wage.
A reasonable amount that allows them to pay their bills on time and put food on their table without having to pick one or the other.
Maybe enough to put in the bank so that when the inevitable bad thing happens they don't have to lose everything.

You know I'm not talking about the moon.
You know I'm not talking about something that is unattainable.
There are countries that don't have minimum wage laws, (Germany and Switzerland).
They do have laws against paying immoral wages.
So if company pays less than a living wage or above they can be prosecuted.
They also have some of the strongest unions in the world, something else we need.
 
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I come from a state that doesn't have a state income tax and give a yearly dividend to every resident from the permanent fund the state set up back in the 80s.
It's certainly not possible for every state but it works there.

Holy s***, I hope you weren't in Alaska, you poor thing. I had read about those yearly checks from the oil industry or whatever it was, years ago. I wouldn't move there even if I was offered a job in my current field for $300k.

They need a living wage.
A reasonable amount that allows them to pay their bills on time and put food on their table without having to pick one or the other.
Maybe enough to put in the bank so that when the inevitable bad thing happens they don't have to lose everything.

You know I'm not talking about the moon.
You know I'm not talking about something that is unattainable.
There are countries that don't have minimum wage laws, (Germany and Switzerland).
They do have laws against paying immoral wages.
So if company pays less than a living wage or above they can be prosecuted.
They also have some of the strongest unions in the world, something else we need.

And please, without any of this "save teh rich peeple!!1111one Down wit teh layzee!11!" bs we always hear. For such a social species where historically everyone helped everyone else to survive, because it made the whole stronger and more successful, we've become remarkably selfish and dispassionate toward each other. "Every person for themselves" really isn't necessary. Or fruitful.
 
Holy s***, I hope you weren't in Alaska, you poor thing. I had read about those yearly checks from the oil industry or whatever it was, years ago. I wouldn't move there even if I was offered a job in my current field for $300k.

Born and raised.
Moving back soon.
 
Some states have minimum wage exemptions for small businesses. If a business makes less than X amount per year, they can pay less than minimum wage.

What I don't get is why people who get tips get lower than minimum wage, and that this is spelled out in the labor laws. I don't understand that. It's f***ing stupid. Tips are money the business was never going to see, so who cares? The business provides a service, has a price for that service, the price is paid by the patron as spelled out on the bill, and that's that. Nice, simple transaction. So, what's with all the whining about how much they make in tips, so much so that there needs to be a law to bring the worker down? "Wages plus tips will equal minimum wage, so it's ok" is weak as f*** as a "reason".

Because they get tips. If their server wages + tips are less than minimum wage, the employer has to pay them the gap. (Where I live). A better question is, is why so many servers don't report all their tips. I've known some people who have been servers and this is common. So they are cheating their employer out of more wages as well as the IRS.
 
I know what the claimed reason is. I just don't agree that it makes one drop of sense. Minimum wage is minimum wage. The End. If there's going to be strings attached to it, it should be called Conditional Wage. Tips don't have squat to do with the business. That's purely between the server and the served. The business charges a price for their goods and services, that price is paid via the bill/check at the end of the meal, end of story. It's not like a tip is some kind of lost business, like the MPAA/RIAA erroneously claim piracy is. And it's not like it's some kind of business expense either. If the way tips worked was that they came out of the bill, that'd be one thing. Like, if the bill was $20, and the tip was $5, then the business only got $15 because they had to pay $5 to the server as a tip, ok. That might make sense. But that's not the way a tip works. It's over, above, and beyond the bill. I don't know how that ever got written into the laws; it's really slimy.
 
Tips... If you are caught accepting one as a TM, you can be terminated. That is what is BS about Target.

As far as servers, many people tip because they assume the server has a lower wage. If wages are raised for them, tips will likely fall.
 
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