Archived Shift cut controversy

[theissueoftissue]

The STL and HR don't have access to the recorded call. They get a call from a third party (integrity team) who explains the components of the complaint. They direct the leaders to investigate and say they'll check in shortly

I was just curious, thanks!

 

[SrTLall]

To be fair we're not talking about state laws. We are talking about Target best practices.

You've been in leadership a long time and so you know an etl hrs biggest fear is missing payroll.

I think it was made clear in this thread to let your leadership know you would prefer not to cut your shift. If your leadership doesn't respect that it's not a bad idea to call the hotline once you've exhausted all other options.

Is it really a Target best practice? Or is is an AStores/Districts/Groups/RegionANTS thing. Trucks get cancelled often enough so that whole teams are called and told not to come in. Imagine if all those TMs said 'too bad, I'm scheduled, I'm coming in,' that wouldn't fly.

As per the OP, all options were not exhausted, rather barely any options were exhausted. There may be more to the story, but it wasn't posted here. I'm clearly not a fan of hiding behind the hotline because of a failure of communication without even challenging upwards.

 

[HRZone]

I'm clearly not a fan of hiding behind the hotline because of a failure of communication without even challenging

Me either. As someone who would directly be effected by it. I would hope a tm would come to me if a leader told them that then find out about it from an integrity investigator.

Trucks get cancelled often enough so that whole teams are called and told not to come in. Imagine if all those TMs said 'too bad, I'm scheduled, I'm coming in,' that wouldn't fly.

I'm glad you used this example because when it does happen we call everyone and most are happy to get the day off. Some don't get the message and show up. In my experience they end up working anyways and we use them to catch up on backroom or brand.

 

[Thunderbird1956]

It's in the employee handbook. Your schedule can change up to 24 hours in advance, but they have to notify you. If they don't notify you have a picture of the paper schedule or MyTime schedule and say you can work or would like to be keyed for the 3 hour minimum. The poor planning by store management is not your responsibility.

 

[Times Up]

If they have to cut hours then you will be asked to go home. Its finanical responsibility on the STL.

Financial responsibility on the STL, who apparently overspent earlier this month, but hardship for a lowly TM. So STL protects his bonus, and maybe a TM can't make rent.

 

[SrTLall]

It's in the employee handbook. Your schedule can change up to 24 hours in advance, but they have to notify you. If they don't notify you have a picture of the paper schedule or MyTime schedule and say you can work or would like to be keyed for the 3 hour minimum. The poor planning by store management is not your responsibility.

So just to be clear, any or all scheduled can be deleted. The only time you get paid for 3 hours is if you are already at work and they decide to shorten your shift, which, presumably, would be shortened to 3 hours. According to the wording, Target doesn't even have to notify you 24 hours in advance, they will just make every effort, which in some circumstances (yes I know, not every) could be none.

 

[SallyHoover]

So if you are at work, the schedule on the board has you for 4 hrs, they can come up to you at 3 hrs and tell you to go home now? If there are multiple people on the same shift and they ask for volunteers saying there are 4 of you and I need 2 of you to leave, if no one volunteers who and how do they decide?

 

[unknown]

All I have to add is that the next time this shit happens at my store, I'm showing up for every shift I've been scheduled for.

Target posts the schedule 2 weeks out. I work my life around the schedule they post. I'm asked to work 6am one week. Then overnights. Then 4am.

Then they pull the shit of telling, not asking, me to not come in less than 16 hours before my shift.

Never again.

Remember, this is the company that lost over $10 billion dollars in Canada. Of course they can't write a schedule.

 

[Bosch]

3. Your ETL-HR made a mistake, the hotline was called and the situation was resolved. So because of that one mistake, you're now going straight to the hotline every time. People cry bloody murder on here all the time about retaliation, yet it seems like you're doing just that.

When your in store leadership can't be trusted you need to go outside the fence and get others to look in. And that was no mistake.

 

[CoolLife24]

At my store they ask if you want to leave early but you can stay if you want. It does not affect performance if you leave early its just cause of the payroll thing. They also cancel a shift with a day of warning well they ask you if its ok to have a day off on a day they put you to work but it is your choice again to come into work or not but still wont affect anything its just cause of the hour cuts they need to cut to make the pay roll or what ever their problems is.

 

[Thunderbird1956]

According to the wording, Target doesn't even have to notify you 24 hours in advance, they will just make every effort, which in some circumstances (yes I know, not every) could be none.

I'm going to disagree with @SrTLall. Every effort does not mean none. The handbook is the contact with the employee and would fall under effort provisions. In actual use reasonable effort and every effort would be synonymous. The only way none would apply is if it was due to a force majeure (power outage, hurricane, etc). That's why I tell TMs to have their cell be the primary point of contact so they can have both a message and a call log. If they don't even call you no attempt was made.

It can be a ASANTS, and there will with out a doubt be pushback if the store hasn't had anyone pay attention to the handbook, but it's one of the things that if you document you can go to the hotline with, so document, document, document and show up in the store. They are going to try to hold you accountable if you don't show up, this is just your side of the coin in keeping them accountable.

Target has very specific ways they are to ask a TM to leave so that it's considered volunteering.

 

[Dog]

Hmmmm. I received a call from Spot today (my day off) and they always leave a message when they want me to come in.

This time it was just a call, no message.

Is your voicemail box full?

 

[Kartman]

I found out that they were calling me in to work.

However, they DID cut a shift next week... I have 4 friggin days off!

 

[HRZone]

So there was some truth to everything we all said.

They can cut your shift with 24 hours or more of notice although asants. In my district we only ask for volunteers.

If they try to cut in less than 24 like @Thunderbird1956 they HAVE to give you minimum pay if you show up.

If they try to cut your shift and you don't get the message. They are supposed to use you for at least 3 hours supporting another work center (say cashiering if the truck was cancelled) then they can send you home

 

[pellinore]

So, zabbaza.....your original issue was about getting shifts cancelled without notification. I think that the answer that HRZone gave ^^^^^ is the best one to pay attention to.
Now, the only thing to make sure you do is to talk with ETL-HR about these shifts being cancelled. If the answer or solution is not found soon and explained, then you should consider calling the hotline.

 

[SrTLall]

I'm going to disagree with @SrTLall. Every effort does not mean none. The handbook is the contact with the employee and would fall under effort provisions. In actual use reasonable effort and every effort would be synonymous. The only way none would apply is if it was due to a force majeure (power outage, hurricane, etc). That's why I tell TMs to have their cell be the primary point of contact so they can have both a message and a call log. If they don't even call you no attempt was made.

It can be a ASANTS, and there will with out a doubt be pushback if the store hasn't had anyone pay attention to the handbook, but it's one of the things that if you document you can go to the hotline with, so document, document, document and show up in the store. They are going to try to hold you accountable if you don't show up, this is just your side of the coin in keeping them accountable.

Target has very specific ways they are to ask a TM to leave so that it's considered volunteering.

How can you disagree with me and then list a way you agree with me?



Although, I believe if your shift is canceled due to the store being unexpectedly closed, like a power outage, you get paid. What I'm saying is sometimes it's impossible to give 24 hours notice, what if you don't know you need to cancel a shift 23 hours beforehand? 12 hours? The night before? Then the answer is 'none' to the question of 'was every effort made 24 hours in advance?'

 

[SrTLall]

So there was some truth to everything we all said.

They can cut your shift with 24 hours or more of notice although asants. In my district we only ask for volunteers.

If they try to cut in less than 24 like @Thunderbird1956 they HAVE to give you minimum pay if you show up.

If they try to cut your shift and you don't get the message. They are supposed to use you for at least 3 hours supporting another work center (say cashiering if the truck was cancelled) then they can send you home

As HR, you know you can't speak in absolutes. Target does not HAVE to pay you if they didn't notify you 24 hours in advance. Just one example: Wednesday's truck is cancelled, no one at the store knows until Tuesday evening, calls are made and voicemails are left. A TM comes in for the truck the next day and didn't get the voicemail that was left for them, do you think Target legally has to pay them? No. Does the handbook/best practice say Target has to pay them? No. Will that store find something for that TM do and let them work? Most likely, but I'm sure there have been cases where the store was in a bind and didn't let that TM work, and that store would have been within their right to do that. If that happened to me, I'd let them work, but I'd also let them know they need to check their messages before coming to work. Who doesn't check their phone when they wake up?! This reminds of the TMs who call and say they weren't aware of the weather conditions so they will be late to work .

 

[Thunderbird1956]

@SrTLall my point is Target pays employees during force majeure events as a sign of good faith. They can't notify people because it's an "act of god," but those would be the cases that they wouldn't have to. Those events are also things that affects the whole store or district so 1 they can't easily shift load, 2 they would lose a lot of people quickly 3 they get good will from their employees.

If a voicemail was left 24 hours in advance that's notification and burden is shifted to the TM.

Best practice is also that TMs get at least 4 hours a week. I've been in stores where full TMs & TLs got left off the schedule, not even a 4 hour shift. And then called and shifts cancelled to cut hours so they had no hours at all that week. Those are things that they could go to the integrity hotline with. If you're seasonal they can treat you like dirt and there is a separate seasonal contact that applies. There is a report that shows TMs that aren't scheduled for a week. The TM should talk to HR if they get left off the schedule, but it shouldn't have happened in the first place.

 

[Frontlanegirl]

As HR, you know you can't speak in absolutes. Target does not HAVE to pay you if they didn't notify you 24 hours in advance. Just one example: Wednesday's truck is cancelled, no one at the store knows until Tuesday evening, calls are made and voicemails are left. A TM comes in for the truck the next day and didn't get the voicemail that was left for them, do you think Target legally has to pay them? No. Does the handbook/best practice say Target has to pay them? No. Will that store find something for that TM do and let them work? Most likely, but I'm sure there have been cases where the store was in a bind and didn't let that TM work, and that store would have been within their right to do that. If that happened to me, I'd let them work, but I'd also let them know they need to check their messages before coming to work. Who doesn't check their phone when they wake up?! This reminds of the TMs who call and say they weren't aware of the weather conditions so they will be late to work .

I don't check my phone when I wake up.

 

[HRZone]

Target does not HAVE to pay you if they didn't notify you 24 hours in advance

They do, I'll post the policy tomorrow

 

[unknown]

As HR, you know you can't speak in absolutes. Target does not HAVE to pay you if they didn't notify you 24 hours in advance. Just one example: Wednesday's truck is cancelled, no one at the store knows until Tuesday evening, calls are made and voicemails are left. A TM comes in for the truck the next day and didn't get the voicemail that was left for them, do you think Target legally has to pay them? No. Does the handbook/best practice say Target has to pay them? No. Will that store find something for that TM do and let them work? Most likely, but I'm sure there have been cases where the store was in a bind and didn't let that TM work, and that store would have been within their right to do that. If that happened to me, I'd let them work, but I'd also let them know they need to check their messages before coming to work. Who doesn't check their phone when they wake up?! This reminds of the TMs who call and say they weren't aware of the weather conditions so they will be late to work .

Do you follow other threads? There are people writing how they are having their shifts cut by text, online, etc. These are not isolated incidences. It's indicative of a widespread culture within Target's management that says ... We can't effectively manage our business and write a schedule for it.

 

[commiecorvus]

I don't know how many Targets there are in NYC but they have a The Fair Workweek Law.
The Fair Workweek Law mandates that retail and fast food employers provide work schedules to their employees 14 days in advance of the first day of the schedule.
If changes are made to the schedule, certain premiums must be paid to the employee, ranging from $10 to $75, depending on whether shifts or hours are added, cancelled or changed and the amount of notice given."

So I suspect they don't play with TM schedules in NYC.

 

[HRZone]

Target does not HAVE to pay you if they didn't notify you 24 hours in advance.

Actually we do.

If we don't get a hold of you and you show up to work. You have to be paid.

Now if your store calls you, you answer and they tell you to stay home. That's different

 

[SrTLall]

Actually we do.

If we don't get a hold of you and you show up to work. You have to be paid.

Now if your store calls you, you answer and they tell you to stay home. That's different

View attachment 4720

Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but it doesn't look like those passages are talking about shifts being canceled, rather TMs who are being called to come into work.

 

[IWishIKnew]

I read it the same way. That policy looks crafted specifically to places that have rules like "schedules should be posted super far in advance so people can plan! (Except that not everyone's plans can be fully set 3 weeks in advance so what then?)". Namely, if Target calls you or you're scheduled in advance, you get 3 hours guaranteed. If they call you within 24 hours, you get 4 hours guaranteed.